At a recent lunch discussion, my friend and sometimes co-author Morton Marcus asked me if I was aware of the “pro natalist” movement gathering steam on the right. I wasn’t.
I was aware of the emergence of the “trad wives”–women who, for whatever reason, are asserting their desire to retreat back to the kitchen and nursery. My superficial understanding of that particular “movement” suggests it’s part of White Christian Nationalism, with its reliance on biblical cherry-picking and–especially– fear of the hated modernity that allows those “others” to claim equal civic status with “Godly” folks. But I hadn’t heard of the natalists.
Morton subsequently sent me a transcript of an interview with a couple named Collins who were attending a convention of natalists. The interviewer began by reminding listeners that both JD Vance and Elon Musk are on record decrying reduced birthrates. Musk–with his 13+ children–has obviously been working against that trend. (Not that he bothers spending much time with most of his offspring, according to interviews with several of them. Evidently the quality of parenting is less important than the quantity…)
The podcast included a clip of comments made by one Charles Haywood at the first Natal Con. Haywood, who made his money as a shampoo magnate, was a sponsor this year. Haywood is heard in that clip saying that “generally, women should not have careers. They should be socially stigmatized if they have careers.” He blames declining birth rates on feminism and the overturning of what he sees as “natural hierarchies of gender and race.”
And there, my friends, you have it.
I have frequently posted my conviction that Trumpism is basically a revolt against equality–against the notion that there are no “natural hierarchies of gender and race.”
I understand why MAGA appeals to mediocre (or worse) White men who resent having to share the civic landscape with women and people of color. I admit to bafflement when it comes to the women who agree with Mrs. Collins that her role in life is to push out as many babies as possible. (I say that as a women who has “pushed out” three of my own–and as the daughter of a woman who insisted that women could–and should–live well-rounded lives that included whatever careers we desired.)
The irony is that the neo-natalists are aiming their criticisms at the wrong culprit. As the podcaster pointed out, the evidence for declining birthrates points not to women’s equality, but to a very different reason. Surveys show that most people continue to want children, but they are increasingly aware of what parenting requires- the ability to provide a stable home, sufficient income, and (usually) a partner.
When a society isn’t providing the social supports that make meeting those requirements possible, prudent people decide to have fewer children, if they have any at all. The lack of government funding for health care, the dearth of affordable housing, the lack of support for good public schools, the high cost and limited availability of child care–all are disincentives for parenthood.
My own grandchildren would add the threat of climate change and our lackluster efforts to address it.
The podcast quoted a scholar who studies this movement and explained its roots: the idea that “our society has become excessively effeminate, weak, compassionate. And what they want to do is breed or elevate an aristocratic class that’s going to be masculine, violent, not necessarily motivated by, let’s call it, empathy.”
The neo-natalists want to restore a “masculine” culture that requires rooting out feminism and multicultural democracy. “Women are to be subordinated to men, largely going to be responsible for managing the household, although with no real particular authority. And of course, they’re going to have an awful lot of children.” And of course, non-White men will be subordinated to their “natural” betters.
If we needed any evidence of how wrongheaded (okay, insane) this belief in a “natural hierarchy” of White men is, we need only look at the “superior” White guys in the Trump administration. It would be hard to assemble a more pathetic, clownish and ignorant group.
The neo-natalists interviewed in this very informative–if nauseating–podcast are enthusiastic Trumpers. They provide additional evidence–as if we needed it–that support for MAGA and Trumpism are today’s eruptions of the oldest American sins: the racism and misogyny of White men who are frantic at their loss of automatic dominance, and angry that they have to compete for status on the basis of actual merit.
I suppose I should thank Morton for the additional evidence of what is really at stake…
“I was aware of the emergence of the “trad wives”–women who, for whatever reason, are asserting their desire to retreat back to the kitchen and nursery.”
Maybe for some it is simply physical and mental exhaustion; they are left with all “kitchen and nursery” responsibilities in addition to a job to help pay bills or an actual successful career in business. Men do not willingly, or cannot be forced, to step into the “kitchen and nursery” to maintain their homes and families.
“The interviewer began by reminding listeners that both JD Vance and Elon Musk are on record decrying reduced birthrates.”
This issue steps into the realm of the male ego at its highest level; the number of children produced is notches on their you-know-what, attesting to their manhood. The fact that their permission in religions for birth control or ending a life-threatening pregnancy being available or not attests to their “higher power” in whatever form it takes, is evident in todays male control over women’s health care as they can be provided with erectile dysfunction medications and mechanical devices to keep them sexually functioning.
If I sound like a former wife who was subjected to such “kitchen and nursery” and numbers of children who required permission from husband for life-saving birth control surgeries…MEA CULPA!
I don’t understand why anyone would force someone to live a lifestyle that They do not embrace! This is not a so-called Christian teaching.
The whole point of being a Christian, is to reject moral turpitude for yourself. Not force someone else to go by your standards. If you are standards are scriptural truly scriptural, as Christ said, give Caesars things to Caesar and God’s things to God. But you cannot force anyone to do those things.
I mean there are these wealthy so-called Christians who cheat Caesar out of his tax, and, The things that God wants, are something which has to come from the church. But it doesn’t come from the church, it comes from scripture, which are two different things.
In the old and New testament, it says that man and woman should be one flesh. You don’t harm your own flesh! When people come together, there is an agreement that respects the other person’s desires concerning living standards, children, financial efficacy, and the like. And it’s nobody else’s business. And you can’t force that on anyone else. As it also says in Scripture, humans are free moral agents, so they are free to make their own choices. But not free to force their own choices on someone else!
Let’s face it, in the end, we are all judged on how we live our lives, not by our friends or our neighbors, but the one who matters! And if you don’t believe that, well, you are free to do so! A free moral agent! If you happen to be wrong, well, you’ll find out yourself eventually!
There are many famous documents written by governments of men, which askew true rights and privileges for actual and long held restrictions. Like, quality for those of different ethnicities and races, males and females, those of all caste systems, those of all creeds, and, you get the drift. It is humans and alienable right to have access to water, food, shelter, medical care, education, a family if so desired, shelter, and love! But these documents although sounding fantastic, are usually not worth the paper They were written on. An example of moral turpitude in these fantastic writings, would be the papal bull of the late 1400s. In which the church authorizes slavery. It also, puts a premium on belonging to a particular race. Our god-given choice to live our lives as we choose, is done for a reason. And it’s not to be trampled on by mankind.
The Declaration of the rights of Man, or the Bill of Rights, and earlier writing, still allowed infathomable bloodletting! Religion has never followed scripture, therefore, it always gives in to the lowest denominator of bigotry, war, and death.
One note to John’s post: didn’t man write all scripture?
The fact that this sect is created by man and then forced on other men sounds a lot like a religion with all its fun dogma to boot!
The declining birth rate is a global problem, except for some African nations. Scientists are raising red flags because birth rates aren’t keeping up with death rates, meaning our potential extinction. It seems to be a mathematical equation. Many global citizens and leaders have different beliefs about why and offer varied solutions. China is even worried and has lifted its tax on additional children to motivate increased birth rates.
If you ask Erin Brockovich why this is happening, she’ll tell you it’s 100% environmental. Our water is contaminated with too much estrogen, which explains why men have such low testosterone and young girls mature at such an early age. Men have symptoms of ED and depression and get prescribed pills. This is why today’s men are perceived as more feminine than in years past.
The explanation and solution are science-related – not religion.
One note on feminists: maybe Trump will declare them to be enemies of the state and deport them to faraway lands.
I wonder if the shampoo magnate offers maternity leave to his female employees, and what is the length of time for said leave–if any?
Low low birth rates is just a symptom of a complex problem and the pro-natal movement is just a simplistic answer. It seems obvious that willfully ignorant people would have a hard time understanding the root causes.. This kind of thinking is true across the MAGA movement. Take a look at the complex policy problem of the loss of strategic manufacturing in the United States. A simplistic answer is tariffs tariffs tariffs!
Those “pro-natalists” might consider protesting the ongoing slaughter of entire populations in the Middle East and Africa. Perhaps it isn’t really new life that they are concerned about, but rather the color and religion of new life.
Leave it to the right wing Christians to find a new way to hate.
(pic) of, haywood,he looks like a stepford wife programmer. the account of why there is a lack of baby moms in labor,may also have its roots that our country has become a run to the bottom and shoveling war lords to the presidency has made that reality front and center. information on the net is shoved under your nose and becomes info overload,while your trying to just survive. i believe the human species has evolved to reduce ones own output to the overloaded world and seek refuge from the glaring bullshit one has to tackle in a modern internet world of nothing gained. wake up,go to work,shut up,make profit,return to over priced world of present realities. they the billionaires have taken enough from us that now they demand slavery as a lifestyle. this guy haywood is a typical nut in idahos back woods on a locked up compound,that he expects us to respect. spend a few weekends up there and do the local haunts,bars, bait shops etc, and talk with these types. ya wonder if your still in America. my travels have been about the blue collar life. i stop and get out of my truck anywhere,and look around. parked and secure,(hopefully) i mingle, shoot some pool and have a few cold ones. i have lively conversations with like,socio,economically same white guys all the time. under tones, i wouldnt trust most of them. this is not a overnite change. its been brewing for 45 years driving over the road. the once upon a time comradery in trucking has become walk alone and mind your damn buisness while someone/anyone your dealing with sticks a knife in your back. unless of course,you frequent their church,their world of whos who and stick to shit talk they want to hear. and ya wonder why people dont want to saddle another human being with a world run like trumps demented maggots. ill tell ya, being raised in the NYC area and making my way across America all my life,has made me look thru the fence at what we achieved. nothing…
Ian;
he sold out years ago.look up his bio. hes locked into a world of his own accord.
Good Grief! Another lame attempt to demonize all humans not white and bible-thumping? I am reminded of my childhood where this was all around me; it became clear to me as soon as I stepped into classes at college where I learned all about humanism, The Enlightenment, et al, confirming and explaining my discomfort with the old order. I had an old friend who was born again, fervently believing in the supremacy of the men in her life, including her husband of course, especially her husband, who ruled. Another religious stance that astounds me still.
Many aspects of culture are imprinted on us in our early development years. While they all define who we are by imprinting in our brains how people like us behave, as we reach adulthood, we can question which aspects are helpful and which are not.
Gender roles are interesting because the behavior exhibited by our parents may not have ever resolved which gender roles worked for them. Some parents indicate this dissatisfaction loudly and publically, which also becomes part of our culture.
There are also instances in which couples find that they are very compatible with such things.
Memes like tradwife or natalist work for some couples, but freedom grants us unrestricted access to our inbred legal behavior cultures, whatever they are.
When we live in a functional country, have adequately functional parenting, and have a spouse who naturally fits our imprinted culture of marriage, things tend to go well with us.
Unfortunately, MTV wants to tell us who we should be instead of accepting our diversity.
I missed the part about this Haywood character being a resident of Carmel, Indiana. I remember reading about this guy’s compound (home) with military-like figures guarding it for him. He’s slightly “paranoid of leftists.”
I’m not sure if I would call them “leftists.” Still, I do know there is a groundswell movement of real Americans wanting to confiscate the trillions stolen by billionaires over the years from our government and set up in foreign trusts and protected by banking laws. They want to use our Constitution and the laws against these oligarchs and take back the “core US government.”
Maybe Haywood is afraid these “Hoosier Leftists” are coming for his shampoo fortune and need bodyguards.
#Paranoid
I was a biologist. An interesting possibility (at least to me) regarding low birth rates in humans is that among other mammals, population density may influence birth rates. As any good ecologist will tell you, populations are controlled by the availability of resources. When one of the resources is stressed, the population responds with, among other things, lower birth rates. In spite of lower birth rates populations grow geometrically which helps explain why the Earth is over populated. It would not surprise me if humans had a programmed mechanism to control population.
The endocrine system has many interacting parts which could influence fertility, sperm count, desire, etc.
What Theresa said!
BTW, if the human race goes extinct, the planet will heave a deep sigh of relief.
If any of our commenters said this I missed it. This is an attempted return to patriarchy. And the problem with patriarchy is it is designed to keep us ignorant (men) or helpless (women) Femininity (not saying women necessarily) is about being open to what is going on around you, connecting with the people in your world, and as much emotionally as intellectually. We won’t make an intellect decision that feels uncomfortable, so not knowing our emotions is critical. Your connections, particularly emotional connections, inform one about what’s going on in one’s community. Masculinity (I am not saying men) is about envisioning possibilities and acting to make the real – managing, controlling, forcing, powerful are all masculine traits that are used to envision possibilities and make them real.
But what’s the most important thing to do before you act? To understand what’s going on with the people your actions will impinge upon, precisely what the feminine helps you understand.
So the man who is only masculine, all powerful, unafraid of anything, except he’s terrified of the feminine, act without understanding how his actions will affect others. And the woman who is connected, caring, understand’s exactly what’s going on through her connections, isn’t allowed to act, to use the masculine. So the men are incompetent because of a lack of understanding, the women are helpless because no one listens to women. And thus you have patriarchy. Except there’s one thing missing. What holds this system together? Why is it so resilient in resisting change? The glue that holds it all together is shame. Women are shamed for claiming any aspect of masculinity. And men are shamed for being in any way feminine. Shame is the glue that keeps the patriarchy alive. Watch Brene Brown’s Ted talks. And then read her books. Her work with shame is the missing piece to understanding patriarchy.
From studying biology, I learned that diversity is a strength. Lack of diversity is a weakness. This is true for a population, a species, the Earth’s biosphere as a whole, and any community of living things in between. The less diversity, the greater the chsnce of extinction. Of course, to realize that this also applies to the human species and its various levels of organization, one must understand that we are a part OF nature rather than apart FROM nature. A lot of people seem to be unable to reconcile this with their religious beliefs and that may cause them to reject scientific findings. That can lead them to some very dark places. This “pro-natalist” movement is just one among many. Think human sacrifice, inquisitions, crusades, climate change denial, and the.myriad conspiracy theories that are wholly disconnected from reality.
The notion that women should always be in the kitchen and having babies is so much nonsense. Women of the working classes have always worked both inside and outside of the house. They were cooks, housemaids, bakers, seamstresses, laundresses, took in ironing, midwifes, nannies, tutors, nurses, teachers, clerks, etc., even if they were married and had children. The work done on farms was just as intense. Besides the household chores, cooking/baking, sewing/needlecraft and child-rearing, they did the gardening, canning and managing livestock, preserving and selling any surplus to have “pin money” of their own if they were lucky.
That notion also ignores the fact that some women never marry, never have children by choice or circumstance. The logical result of their kind of thinking, is the elimination of women who are unable to unwilling to bear a child as “unproductive”. Indiana was one of the first to introduce forced sterilization.
“In 1907, a new law passed by the state legislature and signed by the Governor of Indiana provided for the involuntary sterilization of “confirmed criminals, idiots, imbeciles and rapists.” Although it was eventually found to be unconstitutional, this law is widely regarded as the first eugenics sterilization legislation passed in the world. In 1927, a revised law was implemented and before it was repealed in 1974, over 2,300 of the State’s most vulnerable citizens were involuntarily sterilized. In addition, Indiana established a state-funded Committee on Mental Defectives that carried out eugenic family studies in over twenty counties and was home to an active “better babies” movement that encouraged scientific motherhood and infant hygiene as routes to human improvement.” …Indiana Eugenics, IU.edu
The whole idea is racist and misogynist, “A Handmaid’s Tale” in progress.
You kind of have to remember, Indiana was one of the first states in the Union who embraced eugenics. Indiana always seemed like it had a different way of looking at stuff. Why that is? Maybe you know!
Families thrive when husband and wife treat each other with love and respect, when parents love and train their children, and when children obey their parents. (Ephesians . 5:33; 6:1, 4)
When a husband and wife speak cruelly to each other, it causes emotional wounds, is it possible to hurt your mate without even realizing it? You may feel that you are kind to your mate, but how does your mate feel? If something you said hurt your mate, would you be willing to change? (Galatians 5:15; Ephesians 4:31.)
Be it the exhorter in exhortation; the giver of his goods in largeheartedness, the manager of affairs in devotion to duty, the comforter of misfortunes in cheeriness; 9 love with no sham about it; detesting what is wicked, sticking tight to what is good; 10 in brotherliness mutually affectionate, in honor showing mutual deference, 11* in earnestness not slack, enthusiastic in spirit, conscious of being bound to the Lord’s service, 12 blithe in hope, steadfast in distress, devoted to prayer, 13 showing solidarity with the needs of God’s people, forward in hospitality. 14 Bless your persecutors: bless and do not curse. 15 Gladness with men who are being glad, weeping with weepers. 16 Interested along the same line, for each other; not occupied with thoughts of high things, but drawn into the interests of lowly people; do not feel as if you were great thinkers. 17 Not paying anybody back a bad turn for a bad, keeping in mind what is going to be good before all men; 18 if possible, as far as depends on you, keeping at peace with all men; 19* not taking your own revenges, dear ones, but leave room for God’s anger; for it is written “Mine is vengeance, I will requite, says the Lord.” 20 But “if your enemy is hungry feed him, if he is thirsty give him a drink, for in doing this you will be piling live coals on his head.” 21 Do not be beaten by the bad, but beat the bad with the good. (Starting at Romans 12: 8-21)
This is what I mean about scripture the church does not follow Christ’s dogma, they pit one against the other! So they are considered apostate in conduct, word, and deed! They do not follow the teachings of Christ.
There is a Taoist image that depicts the whole of creation, yin-yang which symbolically represents the calm, peaceful, balance that is possible. In this country we’ve been “Yanged” by male dominance. The discord caused by the unnatural hierarchies of gender and race have caused much suffering and grave injustice. The energy to satisfy that way/system is exhaustive especially to women and detrimental to health.
In this country with the offer of freedom in our democracy, the bonds of authoritarianism have been loosened. Currently the threats from the right-wing authoritarian regime that want to back track to some non-existent ideal is insane.
Their authoritarian methods of fear, shame and intimidation to silence and control are disrupting our well-being and way of life.
We have two beautiful young grandchildren Hispanic and Irish American who are thriving. They are becoming bi-lingual and quite verbal. Also, in my family a brother died of melanoma, and I don’t worry so much that my grandkids will suffer that fate due to having more melanin in their skin. That’s the opposite of eugenics and is a strengthening factor.
With US democracy we have personal choices we can make, custom to our capabilities, to improve our lives. We can allow evolution to continue on progressive, balanced spectrum that’s better for everyone if we can keep it!
BTW Mitch D
When the human race goes extinct our cats will get along fine without us. Propably better.
…. or probably. (oops)
You nailed it Sheila. It COSTS REAL MONEY to have and support children. Child care alone costs more than college tuition at a state university. Young couples can’t afford the child care, let alone feeding, clothing, health care, a home with more bedrooms, saving for a college education, etc.
If a child has medical problems, such as diabetes or cystic fibrosis, even parents with health insurance can face hundreds of dollars of monthly co-pays on medications. One can only imagine their costs WITHOUT health insurance. How in the world are young families supposed to manage this?
The billionaire class running government in Washington has no idea what we’re talking about.